|
Netsword: Mr. Chen, thank you for joining us. It is an honor to have you. Netsword: I guess I will get things started. Netsword: How did you get started making swords? Paul Chen: When I wanted to start a collection, good quality swords were too expensive, cheap swords were very bad quality, so I decided that I should make my own. Netsword: Do you base your designs on surviving historical examples? Paul Chen: Mostly I studied several antique swords left to me by my grandfather. This also became the start of my collection. I am still looking at different swords and improving my education. Netsword: That is what we are doing as well Mr. Chen. Paul Chen: You are doing the right thing. It will never stop. Netsword: One frustration that is found with most production level blades, is the compromise between historical accuracy in terms of weight, size, and durability for use in stage combat, re-enactment, and live steel play. What aspect do you try to focus most on in terms on aesthetics, historical accuracy and durability? Netsword: I'd like to invite the others to join in as well, and I know we will have more people joining us as it goes along. Karolus: How long have you been involved in sword/knife making? Paul Chen: that is a difficult question to answer directly. Because it is necessary to have both an aesthetically beautiful sword, and a blade which will have the durability of the original blades. Most designs combine these two features but in some cases we will make a sword which is not very beautiful, but which will cut very well, because a lot of people want this. Paul Chen: I made just knives for a few years, from about the age of eight, and then started to make swords for almost thirty years. Netsword: Of your line, which item are you most fond of? Paul Chen: I have not made it yet. Everyday, I think that the winner will come tomorrow. Netsword: With the quantity of swords you make in a mass production environment, by nature, quality control is going to be a concern. What is your philosophy for addressing this? Paul Chen: firstly, we are not involved in mass production, but individual production of swords. We hope to make a video available soon to let everyone see our production. Netsword: That would be fantastic, and I believe it would put to rest a lot of misconceptions. Paul Chen: Secondly, quality control is a very serious concern and we are addressing this problem all the time. We have not yet reached a satisfactory stage, and will always try to improve quality. Teachkenpo: The katanas that you produce has helped fill a big void in the sword market. What can you tell us about the techniques you use to make them? Netsword: As a retailer, I have personally noticed that every batch of swords has shown improvement on the previous one. Do you base the improvements on customer feedback, and if so how do you receive that feedback. Eric: Hi Mr. Chen and all. I am curious about the length and thickness of the tangs in your swords, especially the European and Chinese ones. Paul Chen: Firstly, I studied the techniques of the masters, and then I made a team of experts in forging, polishing, heat-treating, and furnishing. This team has been with me for a long time, and is now generating a second generation of experts. Viper: I recently bought the Scramasaxe Dagger (1075-GT), and must say it is a very nice piece. Eric: Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt, but I've never done the chat thing before, and am unsure of etiquette as well as how the thing works. Paul Chen: We receive a lot of customer feed back through CAS, and we take this very seriously. Of course, we are always trying to on our own to make improvements as well. Netsword: It's not a problem Eric. Karolus: So, what's next? Will there be more western style swords? How about middle eastern or Arabic stuff? Chen: Tangs are subject to a lot of discussion. We firstly try to produce tangs that are strong and also we look at tangs of the original swords and also in some cases we have made tangs stronger than the original designs. Because some people cut things which should not necessarily be cut. Chen: Thank you very much, Viper. Eric: I have the dadao, and I think it is very nice. The tang occasionally shifts in the handle (weather related?). I am wondering if the tang is full length, and strong enough for full speed/power swinging. Chen: Karolus, we had about thirty new items at the Las Vegas sword show the week. CAS will have these cataloged very shortly. We have not considered Middle Eastern swords yet, but we like the idea. Grandpa: Paul, can you give us any details about the steels that you use, and type of pf forge/furnace? Chen: Eric, the tang on the DaDao is fine for what you suggest. If the blade becomes very loose, you should be able to tighten it by turning the pommel. Netsword: Continuing with the quality if you will forgive me, but this topic comes up a lot and I want to make sure we have it covered. I know that you can not buy "seconds" of your swords from CAS like you can the other makers, and I have been told by CAS that you wish all bad ones returned. Could you clarify, for the record, your stance on this? Eric: I don't know if it's possible to turn the pommel ring, because it's wrapped with a cord wrap that continuous with the handle wrap. KLarman: Mr. Chen, do you actually use a clay? Chen: Grandpa, we use various high carbon steels in our swords. Depending on the application. For our forging techniques are designed to improve grain orientation and subsequently strengths. KLarman: Oops, sorry about that. Let me lurk for a few… Chen: Continuing Grandpa, the new samurai swords introduced at the sword show have folded blades of a Swedish steel with which we are very impressed, and we will be using this more and more. KLarman: Mr. Chen, is there a reason why the togari hamon style was chosen for you katana? In collector's circles, the togari is more representatives of Mino blades, which usually aren't greatly appreciated…. Chen: Netsword, you are correct. Any defective items, and yes there are some, are returned to us by CAS both for correction, and study to avoid similar problems. Grandpa: Paul, will you be coming to the blade show again in Atlanta, in 2000? Chen: Hi Keith, we tried to contact you by telephone yesterday. KLarman: Hi, nice to talk to you. I've been in and out with a case of the flu… Chen: just give it a little clockwise twist, and it should be ok. Eric: When I get home, I will give it a try. Still, I'm not sure the cord wrap won't prevent it from turning. Maybe the cord wrap around the ring is separate from that around the handle? Grandpa: Is the Swedish steel one of the regular types or the newer powder metallurgy type? Chen: KLarman, thank you for this good question. Hamon are a philosophical subject. I feel that a smooth hamon is reflective of age, and I am still a young man and so I prefer something vigorous. My name in Chinese Chao-Po, which means morning wave, so waves are very important to me. Chen: Grandpa, yes, I will certainly do my best. KLarman: I understand that. I guess from my perspective, the way the "cusps" of the togari point inwards toward the mune, are less than optimal in some opinions. If they went the other way, they would act a little more like a ashi… Chen: Eric, try it when you get home. If you have a problem, call CAS and they will help you. Eric: Okay, thanks. Chen: Grandpa, it is the new powder metallurgy type which is also being sued by some of the masters in Japan. Grandpa: Excellent! Stratos: Do you actually use the swords that you make? Teachkenpo: Mr. Chen. Would you consider making the Practical Katana with a removable handle, and a more durable Habaki? As a retailer, I feel that I could do a lot of business with that item, if it were improved. Kisagake: And perhaps increase the curvature just a bit more…. Chen: Stratos, Yes, I personally test several of each new style, and if I am not satisfied we make some changes. Stratous: Okay, thank you. Chen: Teachkenpo, The reasons for the fixed handle on the practical katana are associated with safety. We try to make a katana, which will cut well at very reasonable price, and we feel that these can fall into very inexperienced hands. The Habaki will be brass, around about May, not really for reasons for strength, but for reasons of user desirability. Netsword: I have heard a lot of excitement generated by the new "Kurgan" sword you have. Is this a licensed version? And do you plan on producing more useable movie replicas in the future? Teachkenpo: Excellent! KLarman: Mr. Chen-- forgive me if this has already been answered, but do you consider the katana such as the Golden Oriole, and Musashi to be appropriate swords for cutting practice (in experienced hands and under supervision, of course)? Chen: Kisagake, we have heard this request a lot and we are making some changes. Eric: The practical katana looks great. The almost straight blade makes a better "ninja" sword than the practical ninja. Would you consider keeping the blade reactively straight but fixing the plastic Habaki that broke easily in the Swordforum tests? Grandpa: Paul, My compliments on your being in the hot seat, and handling all the diverse questions. Netsword: Yes, I agree with Grandpa, Thank you very much. KLarman: Agreed… Chen: Netsword, the Kurgan sword was made just because CAS had a lot of requests for it. While we like this sword, we really prefer to make real swords. We have no problem with making more movie swords, but this really depends on CAS. Viper: I have a question regarding the Scramasaxe. Is it suitable for cutting? And what kind of tang does it have? Chen: KLarman, Certainly, both swords will cut very well in experienced hands, and this is very much in consideration in the design. KLarman: I was wondering how you felt about it, because CAS Iberia doesn't really market it as a martial arts grade weapon, while Bugei does with theirs. Chen: Eric, we have more people wanting more curve, but CAS will probably have some straighter ones still available. The Habaki that broke has not been returned to us so we can not comment on this, but it is the only that we have heard of. Stratos: What are you doing today to ensure that the Chinese sword gets the respect that it deserves, considering that Japanese swords get all of the attention? Chen: Grandpa, it is a pleasure. I wish that I had more opportunities to do this. Netsword: Keith, I can comment on that. It's not only CAS, but retailers too who avoid marketing them as weapons grade for legal as well as liability reasons. Legally, can't ship a sharp sword to CA, but I can ship a "Decorative Replica". Netsword: Paul, you are more than welcome to join us here anytime you wish. Chen: KLarman, Bugei has a lot of respect from us in their knowledge of martial arts. CAS recognizes the abilities of the sword, but defers to the experience of Bugei. Chen: Stratos, this is easy. The Chinese taught the Japanese how to make swords. KLarman: Grin-- yeah, they learned from the Chinese, but the Japanese got the idea for the clay… ;) Ken: True, Stratos: But did the Japanese ultimately improve upon the techniques they got from the Chinese, to make a better sword? Chen: Ken, thanks for the complement. KLarman: Anyway, some do assume the difference in marketing also implies some sort of difference in structural integrity. Netsword: I may have missed the answer to this, but I know it was asked. Do you use clay in your heat treat process? Kisagake: Are your katanas, particularly the Shinto katana, forged folded? Manji: How do you do your polish, traditional or modern? KLarman: On polishing, the use of acid etch is decidedly modern, but it is also very cost effective. Given a traditional polish of a katana will usually run $1K and up, I think Mr. Chen has come up with an effective compromise in terms of the finish. Chen: Stratos, We believe that Japan had a better environment for developing the sword then china, under many different rulers. We certainly have great respect for the sword makers of Japan. At the same time, the world has not seen some of the beautiful swords produced by Chinese masters and hopefully this will be remedied. Stratos: Yes Sir! Ken: I'll support that. LeeR: I am looking forward to your medieval line of weapons. What items are in the future? Eric: Please make sure you keep the Medieval weapons light! There are too many heavy ones out there! Manji: Are you planning to do any Japanese armour in the future? Chen: KLarman, no. Structural integrity is as whish as possible in both cases. Ken: One question, how can one man produce so many weapons in short period of time? Chen: Netsword, yes we use the clay heat treating method. Netsword: I want to thank everyone for being patient while Mr. Chen answers our questions. Manji: How many swordsmiths work in your factory in Dalian? Chen: Kisagake, the Shinto is certainly forged, as the other katanas, but the steel is not folded in the normal use of the term. Our new katanas, (four different sets) are folded and we hope you can see them soon. Kisagake: We understand he's only one person typing replies to all of us ;) Viper: I am really impressed with the appearance of the damascus blade Viking sword, although I don't own one. Netsword: I agree Viper that is truly a beautiful sword! Stratos: What is the hardness level that you find acceptable for your CAS Iberia production swords, such as the golden Oriole? Some have tested it as to high, which is why it has chipped in some tests. Eric: The viking is great looking, but too heavy. Chen: Manji, Truthfully, we use both techniques. Initial polishing uses some machinery to keep costs down, but finish polishing is always done in the traditional way. Netsword: Eric, I found it to be light than most of the current production models. Teachkenpo: 4 new Katanas. Wow. Can you give us a little info about them? What kind of price point will they be? Viper: My Del Tin Viking is much heavier than the CAS one. Manji: I order a wave katana from Bugei, and I am looking forward to receiving this one. Now when are you planning to finish this order? Chen: LeeR, CAS is working with one of the museums in England on some medieval sword designs. It is early yet, but we plan to have several in production by the end of the year. LeeR: I have found that most any of the production Viking swords are heavier than the Chen Viking. Chen: We agree entirely. ChadA: Is there plastic used in of your rapiers (handles, scabbards)? What about stainless steel? Chen: Ken, I wish that one man could, but I have a wonderful team in Hanwei. Chen: Manji, about thirty-five sword smiths with about four times that number of supporting people. KLarman: Mr. Chen-- I find your Tsuba to be excellent values. Are you considering making a series of matching meuki and fuchi kashira as well? Eric: I've never handled the Damascus Viking, but I thought the weight listed on some of the retail sights was heavy (4 lbs.+) Maybe I am wrong. Manji: Are your new line of Tsubas battle ready? Netsword: Eric, I don't have one on hand, or I would weight it, but 4 lbs seems a bit heavier than it is, it is a sword that you really have to see in person to appreciate. Viper: I wish I owned one of the Hanwei Vikings, I was able to hold one at a cutlery shop. Chen: Stratos, An edge hardness of RC 60 is the best compromise we can find for the kind of use that our katana see. Some of the originals were actually harder than normal as they just had to cut people instead of man made objects. Netsword: Kreylyn, who is generously keeping a hand long of this session, is getting a bit behind. He suggested that now would be a good time for us to take a break so he can catch up, maybe grab a drink or something… Chen: Teachkenpo, Actually, there are four complete sets including Tantos. CAS expects the retail on the Katanas to be between $900 and $1500 dollars. KLarman: The new sets including the Tanto will have the visible hada like the new wave Katana from Bugei? Chen: Manji, you will have to check with Bugei on this one. LeeR: Eric, I just weighed a Chen Viking that I have in stock, and it came out at about 2-½ lbs. without the scabbard. Viper: At this moment, I only own one Hanwei product, the Scramasaxe, but I hope to purchase more someday!!! Chen: ChadA, A little bit of plastic is used in a couple of the rapier handles, the sheaths are actually lined with fiberglass (modern we know, but very effective). We use stainless steel in the rapier baskets. We find this is preferable to plating. KLarman: By the way, I saw one of your starship folders recently -- Neat, interesting design. Congratulations. Eric: Thanks LeeR! Wow, that's great. I always liked it, but had ruled it out because I though it was sooo heavy. The Del Tins are also mostly too heavy, although the DT2070 7th century swords are supposed to be great and just a little over 2 lbs. ChadA: Thanks Chen: KLarman, we are considering making these items. Stay in touch with CAS for timing. Eric: Stainless rapier baskets save on maintenance/oiling time. Ken: I have not had a chance to open the Tuska to see the tank in the golden oriole, is there any stamp or signature on it? Manji: There has been a lot of controversy over the last months about your swords. Why do you think this is? Chen: Manji, Our Tsubas are made of either bronze or steel, and are very durable. Chen: KLarman, yes they will. The hada and hamon will be different on all four sets. KLarman: I'm looking forward to seeing the new fittings and the new blade designs. Thank you. Clayton: Just got here, sorry if someone already asked this, but what's the difference between the Musashi and the Golden Oriole? Chen: KLarman, we are working on some more knife designs we think you will like. Chen: Clayton, a lot of things. Blade length, handle length, weight, etc, etc, etc… CAS can send you a catalog with the details. Clayton: And how do the blades differ from the Bugei ones? Teachkenpo: I must say that a suit of Japanese Armour is certainly on my wish list. Any plans for that? Chen: Clayton, the Bugei blades are built to Bugie's specifications, but in terms of construction there is very little difference. Netsword: One thing I would love to see in the future is more European knives and daggers. Is this something that has been considered? Chen: Teachkenpo, Yes we do have plans. We have four samurai helmets in the line now, and plan to produce a full suit in the foreseeable future. Viper: What kind of tang does the Scramasaxe have? And is it suitable for cutting? Schlager: A line of dueling sabres would be great too! Chen: Netsword, you will see some pictures with the next couple of weeks. Including two renaissance daggers, a stiletto, and a new version of the trident. LeeR: and a set of dueling swords also. Chen: Schlager, we are looking at a "safe" sabre for reenactment right now. Maybe we will look at some traditional dueling sabres later. Netsword: I will definitely look forward to that. LeeR: Where can I/We see pictures of the new renaissance dagger and stiletto? Teachkenpo: could you make a nice Yari to go with the Naginata? Eric: Also, civil War and napoleonic ere sabres would be really cool. It's hard to find anything good in that area. Chen: LeeR, we will try to get them up on the CAS web site ASAP, but please be patient. They are in the middle of show season. KLarman: I've traditionally refinished probably somewhere near 30 of your katana/wakizashi/tanto over the last 6 months. One thing I have noticed is that some users tend to scratch up their blades with the powder in the uchiko ball shipped with the sword (to the point where I am now starting to ship replacement kits with blades I polish). Could I suggest you look into a slightly less abrasive/gritty uchiko ball in the future? LeeR: Thank you Chen: Teachkenpo, no plans right now. Viper: I would like to see more Viking style swords with Damascus blades. That would be really nice. Schlager: Paul, Thank you for the response on the dueling sabres. As everyone has rapiers, and cavalry sabres offered by most other suppliers, are usable only from horseback. Chen: Eric, were working on a rev. war hanger right now. The civil war sabre field is a little crowded, but we may do a really nice one at some point. Eric: Crowded, yes, but not much quality. Chen: KLarman, We appreciate the suggestion, and can certainly do this. Ken: Mr. Chen, is the Golden Oriole came from the Trilogy Samurai movie? Manji: Why do some of your swords have a really long Tsuka? Is this accurate? Chen: Ken, No the Golden Oriel is built around a Chinese story involving a cricket, a mantis, and an Oriole bottom line, "Watch your Back!" Netsword: I'd like to take a brief moment here to give credit to CAS as well, not only were the instrumental in setting up this opportunity for us, but they have made an immense effort to improve communication with the retailers and in sharing information. Thanks especially to George and Donny for tonight. Ken: Mr. Chen, in that movie, there was a Samurai using a long blue Tsuka like the Golden Oriel. Chen: Manji, The handle length is something that is varied a great deal in original swords, depending on the school involved, but one of our main consideration is that we are making swords for much bigger people, and we believe that the sword should match the user. Clayton: Mr. Chen, I heard that the Tsuka on the Musashi is wrapped with leather strips (and glued on), and the ray skin isn't one piece. Is this true? KLarman: And as an observation on Tsuka length, it is possible to shorten a too long Tsuka, but you can't make a too short Tsuka longer… Chen: Clayton, the Musashi Tsuka uses two pieces of ray skin for symmetry. The leather we use is in as long strips as possible. Viper: Mr. Chen, are you going to make any more Viking swords? KLarman: Mr. Chen, how long will you be in the US? I had contacted CAS early this week hoping to get a particular Oriole to you so that you could see something I wanted to make sure you saw… Chen: viper, we are talking to CAS about another Viking swords, possibly with a Niello pommel. Stay in touch with CAS for developments. Clayton: Cool, I just ordered one so I'm clearing up some stuff I've heard in the past. Viper: I'm looking forward to it. ChadA: What metal is the wire wrap on the 1028-gt rapier made of? Chen: KLarman, Yes, we received your email yesterday when we returned from the swords show and tried to contact you by phone. Unfortunately, I have to leave tomorrow, but CAS will be discussing this with you. Netsword: Mr. Chen, one repeated request we get is for bare Japanese style blades, for those who would like to build their own hilt assemblies. Is it possible in the future that bare blades may be available? Manji: Well, I just want to say good bye, and keep up the good work Mr. Chen. I am sure I'll enjoy my sword. Viper: I have the same question as Netsword. Clayton: How much of the building process are you involved in. Do you make the swords yourself, or just design them? Chen: ChadA, this is a combination of brass, and stainless steel wire. Eric: Is your company headquartered in Taiwan, China, Or elsewhere? Chen: Netsword, CAS will be receiving bare Shinto blades in Shirasaya in about four weeks. KLarman: Great -- I just wanted to make sure you saw the picture. And on the kit idea, might I suggest a full sword "Kit" with a plain unfinished Saya, Tsuka core, Seppa, Hapaki, and blade. The user could put on their own furniture, and adjust the Tsuka to their own desires. Netsword: That is excellent! KLarman: On the Shinto in Shirasaya, that truly is great news. I might have to order one for myself… Clayton: got to agree with KLarman, that's a good idea Chen: Clayton, I supervise as closely as possible every aspect of sword production and I have an excellent team of experts watching even more closely. KLarman: On the kit idea, the hard things to make/get out here are Saya, and Tsuka core along with Seppa and Habaki to fit the blade. The rest of the furniture is easy to find, and allows the buyer to make the blade truly their "own" creation. Viper: That is a neat idea Chen: Eric, our company is headquartered in Dailian, which is in Northeast China, on the Yellow Sea. Chen: KLarman, thanks again for your suggestions, the blades will come with a fitted Habaki. We will look at the other possibilities. Eric: How did you become interested in and start making swords? It is good to see a Chinese sword maker making things of good quality. I am Chinese myself, and am just learning about the Chinese weaponry/swords. I think that one thing you could do is bring about more awareness of Chinese weapons. Netsword: Mr. Chen, the only other thing I can think of that would be nice to see in the future. Is it possible to make live rapier blades to be interchangeable with the fencing rapier hilts? Chen: Netsword, watch this space. Netsword: Is someone being a problem? Chen: Netsword, sorry, just a Chinese expression. I mean stay in touch with CAS about these blades. Netsword: Oh, sorry… (embarrassed) Clayton: Mr. Chen, I have a friend who chipped (very big chips) the blade on his golden oriole. Granted, the cow bone test was gross abuse, but is there a place to get a replacement blade? Chen: If your friend returns his katana to CAS, they will return it to me for repair (CAS will provide a quote) he will need to be a little patient, as it has to make a long trip. Chen: Netsword, I appreciate this opportunity to talk to our friends, and have enjoyed very much. With your agreement we will do it again. Thank you. Clayton: Thanks Paul Reiki: Wish I could have come in earlier and been a part of this. Joshua: Me too Netsword: You are welcome. Any time Mr. Chen! Please feel free to visit the discussion boards as well, they aren't real time, but are fun and informative. Eric: Thank you very much. It has been very enlightening. Poncho: Yea, me too. Viper: I like the Chat. Kelly: Me too! Netsword: Thank you for taking the time to talk with us, I wish you a safe trip back home. Joshua: Thanks for being here Mr. Chen. Stratos: Thank you, Chen Chao-Po Kelly: Thanks Paul! KLarman: I very much enjoyed your forthright answers. You are offering a great product for that niche. Reiki: Yeah, thank you Mr. Chen, haven't been around for long, but been a pleasure! Chen: Bye Bye
Special thanks to Tim McCraw for taking the time to make this transcript. This was typed by hand during the session as the chat room has no log feature. We appreciate his time and skills greatly. Much appreciation goes to George, Donny, and Patrick of CAS Iberia for thier time in organizing and planning of this session and to Barry Ross for providing personel and equiptment to make this possible. Thanks as well to Mr. Chen for taking the time from his busy schedule to sit down and talk with us. We enjoyed this very much! © 2000, Netsword.com |